🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@pj @rrb

Dominic : What do you think will happen?

Finch : What usually happens when people without guns stand up to people *with* guns.

-- V is for vendetta

An unarmed populace revolting agaibst their government is a sure recipie for mass slaughter.

@trinsec @gpowerf @realcaseyrollins

Financial.liability might make more sense, i woukd t support even that but its at least more reasonable.

@gpowerf @realcaseyrollins

Yea, i hear ya. Fair.

@gpowerf @realcaseyrollins

Thats ehy i said especially if its applied more generally... if my kid stealing a car means i get arrested for theft, that could be an issue

@eff I really wish you guys would focus more on information (telling us the legalgood and bad of a bill) rsther than telling us how to vote.

Many of us arent followers, we want your expertise so we can be informed enough to make our own decisions.

@realcaseyrollins

I was thinking more about your idea of holding parents liable for their kids actions as a deterrant to scbool shootings

One big concern for that is, especially if applied more generally, would be a huge deterrant for parents to adopt problem children, which coukd have a devestating effect on how these kids grow up if all the most trouble prone kids never get adopted.

@rrb @pj

Yea me too.. put the liability on the owner and have an expectation of responsible behavior.

@rrb @pj

And yea i think affordable mechnisms like trigger locks for cars when you arent in them as well as affordable lock boxes might be reasonable.

@rrb @pj

I think existing liability law could probably handle that well enough... if you have something stolen and were negligent about storage you might have some liability.

That said id be willing to explore it.

My only concern there is

1) the rules for storage cant be prohibitive such as requiring a safe which many people wont have money or access to

2) the user should be allowed to keep it unlocked and without a trigger lock at a minimum while they are home ao in the case of a home invasion thry have quick access to it

One might expect that if you keep a gun at home youd take reasonable precautions if you left town such as security camera or somethibg maybe. As long as the two concerns above are properly balanced i would consider more discussion about ways we could better address this.

@rrb @pj

Ok so just checked... all gu sales in all ststes by dealers (this appesrs to inckude gun shows) require record keeping.

Private sales only requires record keeping in 19 states, though these are demcrat states mostly so thry do represent thr overwhelming majority of the usa population.

I woukd be ok with supporting a federal law that extended the record keeping requirements on gun sales as they currently exist toninckude all private sales.

@rrb @pj

That link has no information about record of sales.. talks about percentage that are federally licensed or not, nothing else...

@rrb @pj

You already have that its just carefully designed to be one way. If you have a gun used in a crime you can track it to its owner. What you cant do is pull up all people in an area that own guns as you coukd with a normal registry.... just as it shoukd be.

@pj @rrb

My argumebt was only half about that. The other hakf was about profiling, whicb we all know would and is an issue right now.

Having a gun in and of itself, something that is a rigbt, shoukd not be able to be used to generate suspicion, which is the only real ourpose of a register.

Now if you susoect someone because of actual evidence, then you have the right, and can, search the records and lookup based on the serial number.

Its the same reason cops cant look up who is poor in order to create a list of suspects for a robbery.

@rrb @pj

This is about restraining orders. And speaking generally that makes sense. You do not need tonprove someone was violent to get a restraining order. Generally they are trivial to get and at no point is there a cojrt case with evidence and a jury being evaluated.... so no someone shoukd t loose their rights to a gun due to having a restraining order unless the violent acts have been proven in court.

@rrb @pj

Id have to read up on the case.. but if you hold a gun to someones head who is not being violent and threaten to kill them, and there is evidence to show this, id obviousky support them taking their gun away.

@pj @rrb

The issue with gun registration is that one day thr government may become oppressive and make guns illegal and thrn those registrations can be used by an oppessive govt.

The other issue is profiling. Cops might use registrations to target people as suspected and as such owning a gun, even if you never use it, makes you a target of wrongful arrest.

We already have a "one-way" system that is essentially a registrstion. As long as you have a gun or its serial number you can track it back to who owned it, but not the other way around. Assuming it is all legal of course.