🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@js290

If youa re asking that question then you are missing the point.

@yaksha @wa__em

@js290 Yes they are. I am not against caution for either. But the level of absurdity coming from the anti--vaxxers is still laughable.

@fp

They are doing god's work!

@matrix

@matrix Leave it to science to expand the limits of human knowledge... My understanding of the universe has changed in utterly profound ways thank to this new and unexpected information.

I think this is literally the most obvious statement anyone has ever made...

@FailForward

Fair points. But we have to admit, the US president is not and never will be as accessible and "just another citizen" as a dutch PM is... you'd hardly even recognize the dutch PM as being special if you saw him riding down the street :)

@trinsec @mur2501

@lain I have been rather vocal that the vaccine is risky since it didnt pass long term safety trials. So I too agree that, for now, one should probably only get the vaccine if at high risk and wait another year or so to see how safe they turn out to be before jumping in.

That said everything ive seen till now clearly shows the vaccine is a much lower risk than the virus.. though some vaccines are safer than others (AZ has shown some nasty side effects so probably not a good first choice).

That said, I will review the study you posted when I get a chance and see if it changes my view on some of my statements.

@FailForward

This is true... which kinda says a lot on a bit of a tangent.. why can the PM of the netherlands safely ride to work every day while the USA president needs an army to follow him.... might have something to do with the fact that US presidents tend to be evil fuckers who are starting wars and killing people (indirectly) year after year

@trinsec @mur2501

@lain Not exactly the same for an important reason though... quantity.

For anything that has any potential to kill anyone on any scale you will always find that the infirm will be the disperportionatly represented majority. It should be obvious why someone who is already sick is more likely to die of anything remotely possible of causing death than someone who is healthy.

It isnt about the fact that people with covid or people getting vaccines are more likely to die with pre-existing conditions. Its the fact that with COVID your hundreds of thousands of times more likely to die than from a vaccine.

In other words, throwing a fit because a very small number of people die with preexisting conditions is not equivalent to throwing a fit because huge numbers of people die, of whom a large proportion had preexisting conditions. Basically the odds of dying are so astronomically higher from covid than the vaccine that you cant compare the reactions to the two as being equivelant.

@FailForward

Well then I guess I pegged him wrong on that.

That said, I highly doubt he is cycling to work at the white house each day like the dutch PM :)

@trinsec @mur2501

@ademan

Your logic isnt too far off, the devil though is in the details.

For example, whats your sample size? How were the sampled from the population? Was it double blind randomly checking members from the population or inferred by just those who show up in a hospital? What about the people who got sick but were so minor they never went to the hospital? etc.

The simple numbers we can run on the back of a napkin is fine and all, but it isnt a replacement for a properly run study.

@wa__em @yaksha

@lain how so? people arent dying in large numbers from the vaccine (though there are fair criticisms of it all the same), so it really cant work in reverse.

If you just mean that the general public seems to underplay some of the vaccine concerns, then yes, I do agree. Bias is a bitch like that, both sides will underplay their own concerns. But its not exactly a symetrical thing when deaths from vaccine are a small fraction of that from COVID and it overall seems to largely save more lives than it costs by a huge margin.

@ademan

the devil is in the details.. you cant draw any meaningful conclusions by just looking at national vaccination rates. You'd have to do a proper study on vaccine effectiveness, which ultimately shows relatively high rates, even on the delta variant (which it has 88% - 94% efficacity on depending on the vaccine you get).

@wa__em @yaksha

@yaksha

It wouldnt be a vaccine, but how is that relevant? Neither the news article you posted nor my own example, presents a condition where a vaccine has zero effect... In fact as I stated a vaccine could be 99.9999% effective and you could still see 100% of people who get the virus having been vaccinated. The wording is simply constructed to be confusing and cause people to misunderstand what is being stated (hint, it is not stating the vaccine is ineffective in any way).

@wa__em

@zpartacoos @trinsec

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

As much as I love my Fluke 289, and all the Fluke accessories they are wayyyyy too expensive. I just cant justify a clamp on amp probe (just the probe no multimeter) that costs 250$, thats more than most multimeters....

@trinsec

I am prettys ure neither Biden nor Trump has ever ridden a bicycle a day in their lives :)

@mur2501

@trinsec

Thats why its showing off.. its the PMs way of saying "look at me I am a perfectly normal person who rides bikes!"

@mur2501