🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@olives Meh, take it to the next level... nuclear fossil fuels!

@Biggles Well no arguments there... the difference is when it is part of group-think, done in unison, and clearly ideologically gated its a very different thing.... nearly all of the extreme-left rejected science en masse to the same tune, much as the extreme right did... the center when it happens it is on a very individual basis and not something that manifests such consistent patterns along party lines.

The problem with covid wasnt simply about early on opinions, it was more about contrarianism.. Anything, and I mean anything, the right formed as an opinion the left had to reject, and violently fight against.. I mean hell I saw more than a few lefties get into fist fights over COVID nonsense with righties.

@animeirl

I'd expect an ar-15 style from a reputable company to be good... cant speak for any of the others out there.

@icedquinn @denza252 @Nudhul

@animeirl

If I were doing fully auto single barrel shotgun I think I'd go with USAS-12 or just a ar-15 modified for 12 ga.

@icedquinn @denza252 @Nudhul

@animeirl @icedquinn @denza252 @Nudhul

Yes I have seen single barrel ar-15 shotguns, and I've seen bullpup pump action two barrel shotguns.

Here is the 2-barrel I have had my eye on for example: https://topguntacticalsales.com/product/standard-manufacturing-dp-12-double-barrel-pump-12-gauge-shotgun-16-round-capacity-black/

@animeirl

Shame, ive been wanting an ar-15 styled shotgun

@icedquinn @denza252 @Nudhul

@Nudhul @icedquinn @denza252

I literally do need this shotgun.. what is it so I can buy it!?

@admitsWrongIfProven Which is why I have never supported "no control". And yes I think with absolutely no control at all it would do more harm than the correct amount of control. Sadly what we have now are governments exerting excessive control which also isnt good.

@admitsWrongIfProven @toiletpaper

yes thats true too, the ideals they claim to have are far removed from their actual intent.

@admitsWrongIfProven Which is why i said an unregulated market is not a free market.

@admitsWrongIfProven

> Of course they are not the same thing, they are two parties struggling for power

No i wouldnt say they are parties either.. while it is true the republican party is ont he conservative side of the spectrum, and the democrat party is on the liberal side, they are not synonymous. You can be liberal and against every principle of the democratic party, just as you can be conservative and disagree with every principle of the republican party.

@toiletpaper

@admitsWrongIfProven

unregulated market is not hte same as free-market... an unregulated market has no government-manipulation but is free for civil-manipulation and gaming.. a free market is a market which operates freely according to market pressures and is not manipulated by indivviduals and minimally regulated by government (enough to ensure the market stays free, but no more).

@admitsWrongIfProven

modern liberal and conservative are not exactly the same thing to me.

left vs right is one dimension on a multi-dimensional political spectrum (where other dimensions re things like personal freedom vs authoritarianism)...

I would define a modern liberal as someone who is on the authoritative-left of the spectrum, a conservative is on the authoritative-right, a libertarian is generally on the personal freedom side of the spectrum, and they are split between left-libertarian and right-libertarians.

@toiletpaper

@toiletpaper @admitsWrongIfProven

I dont think that was much of a change at all. The spectrum remained the same, free-market proponents are certainly more left than dictators or monarchs.. it was true then as it is true now to say, from the perspective of a dictator free-market supporters are left of them.

@admitsWrongIfProven

> So with the basic needs, i guess we agree that food and shelter should be available for everyone existing. You exist as an individual being, you should have food and shelter. So far, so uncontroversial?

While I would certainly agree with you on this point im not sure you can say its uncontroversial. I know many people, at least in the USA, who think some people should be left to fend for themselves, even if that means death.

Its achieved by following my exact set of opinions as a left-leaning centrist of course :) If that werent the case then I wouldnt believe in it :)

> Would a central organization or market actually select for useful tasks or just keep people busy so the peace is kept?

Im not sure what a central market is... you mean like a regulated market, the opposite of a free market?

@admitsWrongIfProven

So extremism side in terms of politics is easy to Identify... If someone has a set of ideologies where anything that is even slightly different, introducing nuance, is "the enemy" then you are dealing with someone on the extreme end.

If you are on the left and see centrists as evil as the right, and even the moderate left as evil, then you are probably an extremist.

Basically you just need to look at how well defined the walls of the silo is.

So yea extremism is easy to identify... now right vs left I think that is harder because you can be right and left in different categories its not an all or nothing thing.

For example communists, socialists.anarchists, progressives. are all generally agreed to as "left" though having quite a bit of ideological difference. Generally I'd say the common denominator of the left vs right is the left focuses on ensuring individuals power is mitigated (to some extent) and that the power and resources need to be spread out and not allow the natural processes of of concentration of power in a small group of individuals.

Therefore common themes among the left are redistreibution of power and wealth and/or the prevention of centralized power (as is the case of anarchism, which even sees the government as bad).

the right on the other hand seems to see a strong centralized power as ok, so long as it comes about through natural power-dynamics. Generally prefering free-markets and seeing accumlated power in a central place as both natural and good.