John BS @johnabs@social.cleverlibre.org

@freemo @trinsec First thing I bought when my wife and I bought our house. I've never not used it since. 100000% worth the investment; my only regret is not getting one with a hot air blow-dry feature.

I'm honestly blown away by how fast computers can do their thing. I computed 2009! on my crappy old Thinkpad in Julia and it just cranked it out like it was nothing, less than a second. Absolutely incredible, considering the result is on the order of 10^5776.

Graham's number though? That may take a while 😂

@freemo Got it; man I have trouble understanding sarcasm over text 😅

@freemo Aren't you the one always telling non-Americans (like Trinsec) they don't have freedom? Was that all sarcasm or are you also pointing out we're getting as bad as the countries you like to claim aren't free? 😂

@namark @zpartacoos I'll have to get back to you soon; I'm really tired and felling ill unfortunatley, but I'll respond once I'm feeling better.

@namark @zpartacoos

1. Yes, because by only considering economic consequences is how we end up endorsing slavery, as we have in Xinjiang. You cannot have a "morally isolated" economic system unless everything is completely controlled and self-sustained by amoral actors (e.g robots). Additionally, there's the whole "is/ought" problem that comes up when desiring to make change (in general) and specifically change that is not necessarily economically feasible in the short term, but is morally necessary in the long term, like ending slavery, or dealing with the consequences of climate change, etc.

2. I'm not saying IP is irrelevant. I'm saying the way you invoked IP laws to defend your amoral (or more generously "economically focused") position is irrelevant. The reason it was irrelevant is because IP laws have not stopped another nation from stealing our IP. We have been effectively powerless to prevent it from happening, due to the "economic incentive" of operating in China, which has actively come back to bite us in full force. So reforming laws which only really impact us internally seems like a perfectly reasonable thing to do.

3. Wait a minute. So what you're saying is that the information is not open, and is protected by copyright instead of patents? In that case, there's even less of an argument to be made, against right to repair, as reverse engineering becomes substantially harder. Even if it's still possible without the designs (which there's a lot of research to suggest it is via electron microscopy), I am going to get the chip one way or another, either by buying the laptop or by buying the chip itself. So if someone is really that dedicated to reverse engineer their parts, it can be done 100%. But considering it hasn't really happened yet, I have a hunch it's not economically feasible to sell apple knockoffs. This isn't even factoring in the massive overhead that would be needed to start and sustain such an operation. In the olden days with simple mechanical machines and parts? Sure. But now, with billions of 7-14nm transistors, I highly doubt it.

4. Honestly, I'm all for open-sourcing everything, and as many SBC manufacturers have shown, it's economically viable, even when the Chinese decided to take your design and sell clones on Alibaba for 1/3rd the cost. I love the RISC chips, the Power9 as well, but we can't make perfect the enemy of the good. We have to start somewhere, and I think the moral arguments for why it must be done easily trump the soft economic reasons of why it "cant".

I actually do fully own and can repair my own laptop (and can flash whatever BIOS, install any OS, etc.) that I want. Aftermarket replacement parts are pretty readily available, but I would prefer direct OEM support. So, instead of relying on benevolence, why not just legislate it via right to repair as I was initially suggesting? It honestly seems like we agree at this point unless I'm missing something here.

@namark @zpartacoos

> Goes directly against culture and IP laws

Not all parts of any culture are good. Some laws are moronic. Some things are sick and need reform. This is one of those things for reasons I'll outline after I deal with your argument.

> For a device to be repairable in principle its design must be open

I'm not sure where you're getting this idea. IP is all "open source" so to speak, in that the patents are public access, and must be to facilitate IP claims in the first place. I can't violate your IP if it's not a registered patent (this makes it's a trade secret, which by definition is not protected IP).

This is NOT about requiring manufacturers to allow others to manufacture their products and infringe upon IP. It's about allowing people to use the existing, (and often already available in some form or another) schematics by purchasing parts made by the manufacturer. All this requires is that the manufacturer sells parts to 3rd party vendors or individuals so they can repair their products with whomever they choose. Clearly this doesn't violate IP in any way, as nobody else gets the rights to produce the parts, only to use the parts.

> This kind of reform will never happen in theUS as long as it is in US national interests. It will make the US weaker and the people poorer overall.

Regardless of what is in "the US' interest" (whatever that waffly idea entails), the citizens of the US have had their right to property decimated over the last 100 years. This is immoral, and needs to be curtailed immediately, hence my desire for right to repair as a stepping stone to protect the ownership rights of US citizens.

Secondly, China regularly steals up to *half a trillion* dollars in IP from the US. *PER YEAR*. IP is NOT a valid protection from them (since we do all our manufacturing there and they completely disregard our and their own laws to get ahead); so reforming it in our own country clearly can't exacerbate the issues of blatant theft of nearly a trillion dollars annually.

Thirdly, one of the reasons so many people are becoming poorer in the United States is due to our trade deficit with China, which is maintained to keep the US dollar as the world's reserve currency and maintain US hegemony. Our citizens suffer directly as a result of this, and will do so even more now that we've pumped trillions of legal (and stolen) dollars into the Chinese economy, the leader of which is a authoritarian despot with aspirations of world domination and Han supremacy.

> Do you want an unrepairable mac or a huawei laptop?

Finally, I currently use a 10 year old Thinkpad on principle, and the Framework laptop (designed, sold, and patented in the US) looks like an excellent, right-to-repair respecting laptop that I will be investing in soon. When they become international, I suggest everyone purchase them as a way to extend your rights and fight against the behemoths who's moral compass only points to money (e.g. the Uygher slave labor used by Apple, Google, etc.).

Sacrificing principles to "protect interests"(whatever that means) screws everyone eventually. The US did it in the middle east, these companies are doing it in China, and we continue to do so at our own peril.

@zpartacoos Just posted a long-form comment on Louis Rossman's channel to help him defend right to repair, if you (or anyone else who sees this) has anything to add that I've missed, go give his latest video a quick watch and see if you can help, we NEED right to repair to get through.

Hi Louis,

I'm a bit of an armchair logician, so I'd like to see if I can help with defending right to repair and you from these clearly disingenuous/uninformed critics. Unfortunately, the 4th amendment has been being turned into Swiss cheese for a while now. So convincing government officials (who honestly don't care about property rights, as evidence by recent legal precedent) to care without inspiring a large enough group of people to pressure them is, well...unlikely. Convincing individuals is likely even more difficult, as many of them "don't know how bad things really are".

One of your strongest attacks should be how this will impact the economy of the areas in which this is passed:

1. Thriving small businesses are critical for a healthy middle class, which has been consistently eroded in recent years. Right to repair will increase 3rd party repair, and the number of small businesses. Competition will drive down repair prices for consumers, create jobs, and **create more taxable revenue in the process** (the only thing these guys care about). Overall a win/win/win for everyone but the tech behemoths, who aren't losing much in the process.

2. The right to repair property in general is one of the clear markers of "true" ownership. If you own something, but are being prevented from repairing it yourself, then you really only own it for as long as the manufacturer allowed you to through their planned obsolescence. In this way, the manufacturer forces further consumption, which we know is worse for consumers, and the environment. By forcing the manufacturer to supply repair parts, we increase the life of our devices, which is better for my wallet, and overall less wasteful. Contrary to popular belief, nobody needs the newest iPhone to prevent themselves from going into Apple withdrawals. Longer device lifetime can ONLY benefit the consumer in the long term.

3. The current implicit "right to repair" (really just basic property rights) respects the property owner's right to repair their home, car, papers, land, and more. By extending this to devices, it only further protects the rights of individuals, who do not have the power to fight large companies without a class-action suit, which honestly provides little restitution to the individuals, as the lawyers take a large cut, and the remainder of the settlement is divided among (typically) thousands of participants. Honestly, we need to bolster property rights in this country, and I'm hoping right to repair is the catalyst for starting that change (look up Institute for Justice on YouTube if you want to get more informed about this garbage).

Your primary defensive arguments should be trying to reason by analogy to other property that we actually do have the right to repair (though again, this is becoming increasingly limited by private entities like HOAs etc. which is just ridiculous):

1. Many people choose not to change their oil, rotate their tires, or maintain their vehicle outside of taking it to a certified repair shop; however, that doesn't mean that allowing car manufacturers to have a monopoly on repairing their vehicle, and preventing oil from being sold to people who want to change their oil themselves, is a good thing for car owners. Clearly the owners will try to up-sell you either on "better" oil, unnecessary part replacements, or even telling you "the whole car is broken, we can't fix it" and forcing you to buy a new one because YOU CAN'T GET A SECOND OPINION SANS CONFLICT OF INTEREST WITHOUT 3RD PARTY REPAIR (thought I should emphasize that point). Same thing for devices.

2. Computers and other electronic tools are even more ubiquitous (and arguably more important to people's lives) than automobiles, so why would the right to repair only impact automobiles, when it should more realistically apply to devices which can literally contain the keys to your entire life, identity, memories, and more. The economic impact of not being able to repair a phone or a computer is WAY bigger than not being able to repair a car, as any car that is similar to yours can be a functional replacement. Your devices likely have unique data that is irreplaceable. Thus, in terms of lost work, diminished productivity, and the need to recover key information like passwords, ssh-keys, photos, documents, programs, etc., sub-optimal device repair is currently a huge drain on the productivity of our economy by preventing the affected individual from working at full capacity.

(rant time)
Honestly it's just common sense that people who own something should be able to do whatever they want to with it, and the companies that produce these devices should be supporting the consumer's purchase and allowing them to fix it when needed, rather than bleeding the consumers dry like bloated ticks. I hope you manage get this passed Louis, these massive, unaccountable companies are a blight on society that's masked by emotionally manipulative marketing, and I hope we finally start winning back some rights to own our stuff that we purchased with our hard earned money, rather than being treated like serfs living on Apple(et. al)'s land.

Good luck!

Grading is done, finally time for a break 😩

@zpartacoos I think it's likely due to the lack of curated content (which is arguably a good thing to prevent doom scrolling and the impact of "infinity pools" on our cognition).

I'll likely be releasing the results of a project I worked on this semester soon, depending on whether or not my advisor thinks it may be suitable for publication (it's a fairly efficient quantum inspired optimization algorithm).

Also, if you ever want to talk about nature inspired algorithms, or other ML/math/programming related work, just let me know! Most of what I post here are jokes for the fun of it, but I would rather discuss intellectually stimulating ideas instead xD

@lucifargundam No problem mate, I'm completely beat from the end of this semester and my brain is at like 40% capacity, so maybe it's a me thing XD

@lucifargundam Ah, got it, I'm not sure why lmao, but at least I'm somewhat following here now XD

@lucifargundam I get that part, but I'm failing to see the connection lmao

@lucifargundam Unfortunately I'm missing the joke here

You know, if you think about it, we're all (locally) flat earthers. The only difference is how you define local...

Merry early Christmas everyone, here's my favorite bass singer doing what he does best!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8Sxh5E2u_g

@IOcase Glad to be of service 😁

@sethhalleway I live right next to a very busy street (which has also had some construction going on) and let me tell you my sanity was unraveling by the minute without my headphones and counter-noise 😂

For those of you with ADHD or difficulty focusing in noisy/distracting environments, a pair of noise cancelling headphones, along with mynoise.net is an absolute blessing (it's free btw).

I really like the distant thunder paired with music, or the "medieval library" sounds as well.

Finally, cleaning up my desk seems to help a lot too, so don't overestimate how a change in your environment (even small ones) can impact your productivity and creativity!