skells @skells@social.cleverlibre.org

@freemo not psyched to get into the trans bathroom thing tbh, I can see both sides of the arguement and it's not a simple issue

more generally, I agree that social norms as thoughts is nebulous af, but i think there are plenty of actions seen as socially destructive that are difficult to practically enforce

white collar crime, adultery, malicious lying etc.

r.e. lying (and setting white lies aside, although i think it's an interesting area...) I've always thought that it was interesting that one of the ten commandments is "do not bear false witness" rather than "don't lie," perhaps somewhat to your point, that not lying is much harder to enforce than giving false witness in a court of law

@vriska @Moon yeah but it's fair to say plenty of guys create the memes

to give the devil her due, some of the funniest people I've met have been lesbians

@vriska @Moon are you suggesting memes have intentions that elude that of their creators

or have memes never made you laugh

@vriska @Moon how do you distinguish funny and entertaining

@freemo my point is that mental reflection is difficult to identify

that you can observe that another person thinks about another person's perspective is true to a certain extent, but it would be going too far that you can infer all of a person's ethical/unethical decisions from their outer behaviour

great timeline everyone, keep it up

@freemo

> considering another person's perspective before taking an action that effects them

> washing your hands after using the bathroom

> forethought and prediction of other road users actions while using a car

> don't anonymously abuse people online

most of them involve mental reflection or invading someone's privacy to enforce

@freemo I understand your position, it's not so clear cut imo

more broadly, we use religion to enforce ethical standards we can't police

the ethics of religion per se is another can of worms though

@freemo

my point has nothing to do with trans-rights, I'm saying a cultural norm being difficult to police and the value of that norm are separate attributes

A = policy/norm X has social value
B = policy/norm X is difficult to police

a priori there's no correlation or link between statement A and B

@freemo i'll tip my cap to gender but in 99.99% of cases sex is a matter of genetics

don't have a horse in this race, found your argument a straw man though

@freemo proven in a court of law is a little different to inspecting peoples genitals on demand

@freemo we don't punish extra marital affairs

next, in todays "spook or retarded" segment...

hey, look, if we've got the capacity to wipe our species from the face of the earth you bet your sweet bippy im eating strawberries out of season

@freemo just because a social custom is difficult to enforce doesn't mean all social customs should be ignored

@adam @zeropolitics I don't see how you get from "Ukrainians started it all" to "Russians started it all" without stopping for breath between the two

it's almost spooky