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> I posted papers in response to you saying there is no evidence that more guns increase mortality. The papers I posted are 100% relevant to the discussion. In both individual households and society at large, greater availability of guns leads to higher mortality (after controlling for all sorts of demographic factors) , not just in suicide but also in homicide rates.
See, thats not what I said at all.. I said **nothing** about overall mortality rate. I talked about murder and violent acts in society as a whole, that is vastly different than mortality rate, which I did not claim and in fact explicitly argued against more than once in the thread by making very clear that suicide by gun is completely unrelated to what is discussed, but would be included in figures of mortality rate.
Thank you for demonstrating for me exactly why you are posting non-sense articles that do not address remotely the assertions I am actually making.
@freemo So you ignored anything i said about sources not being relevant, and now you proclaim your sources were relevant?
I feel overlooked. Did you ever care about the points i made?
@admitsWrongIfProven That wasnt in reference to you.. it was supposed to be a reply to a different thread
@freemo I know. I'm being salty here.
@freemo Guess i'm going to be salty until you answer the stuff you ignored or boot me from the instance, both good. Do you like System of a down, btw?
@admitsWrongIfProven you will have to re-ask whatever i mistakenly ignored.
System of a Down has some good stuff sure.
@freemo i did say that some of your sources were flawed because circumstances made death more likely than usual, see irelands scuffle with england... and also gun bans in america are a bit strange, only in some area, are there borders to enforce this?
You replied with "i am right", and i stil wait for an honest answer.
@freemo i do see your "stuff is complicated" answer, not wrong. But i would have felt more respected if you said that to me directly.
Guns are killing things. If there is any use that saves lives, we need to discover it. Fair, might be. But it needs a basis, not just hope.
Be as direct as you can. You cannot go wrong with me in that regard. I will examine all evidence, but i still wonder if i have been told everything i need to know.
@admitsWrongIfProven guns are killing things.. guns are also preventing things from being killed. The key is understanding the ratio
@freemo You do see that the "preventing" part is being done by killing those that might, right?
No not always or even usually. But when that is true its more often the bad guy than the good guy than would be the case if guns were illegal. But that aside, no, the threat of death can often prevent someone from even executing the crime, or abandon it midway through once they realize they are up against a gun.
@freemo There is no good guy. Who would even have the time?
@admitsWrongIfProven Well sure, some sources might be flawed. But the pattern is so pervasive that there4 comes a point where you stop making excuses and accept that not all the data has excuses one can make for it. In reality we would have to do a more indepth analysis to really prove that, which i dont have time to do here.