@joeinwynnewood

I don't think judges are as cavalier as you think they are.

The judicial system in the US is very, very hesitant to issue such penalties, and for good reasons involving both working relationships and the limits of their powers.

The DoJ's behavior in other cases has and will impact how they handle the matters before them, but it's not as if the judges are going to visit executives at the houses demanding payment.

It's really for Congress to act at this point.

@Nonilex

@volkris @Nonilex

There's nothing cavalier about enforcing court orders.

It's certainly bonkers that it's attorneys in the US Department of Justice and other government officials violating court orders, but it is standard operating procedure to use contempt as an enforcement option.

The more times DOJ and the agencies they represent defy judicial orders, the faster and more heavy handed federal judges will be with contempt proceedings.

@joeinwynnewood maybe one thing to keep in mind is just how common it is for administrations to violate court orders, just not to this extent and to such headlines.

No, it doesn't happen every day, but certainly every administration, which is part of why the judicial branch holds its fire, negotiating for compliance, as they've done with Trump.

You talk about enforcing court orders, but there's the rub: HOW does the court enforce? On its own a contempt citation is worth little more than the paper it's printed on.

Again, this is why the judicial branch must hold its fire when administrations violate orders. It would be strategically cavalier to waste what little power it actually has on any but the most egregious violations.

@Nonilex

@volkris @Nonilex

Destroying government documents, illegal on its face even before a federal court preservation order, is undoubtedly an egregious violation.

Court levied fines are far more than paper. Federal judges can order bank accounts frozen to recover fines owed. If the current corrupt DOJ won't enforce court levied fines, the next one most assuredly will.

Keeping its powder dry would be a terrible strategic error, obeying in advance, giving away the judiciary's power without a fight.

@joeinwynnewood

As you indicate, it comes down to the executive branch enforcing court levied fines.

Because the court doesn't have that power. Wrong branch of government. It's for the executive branch to execute the orders.

That is, act on the slips of paper.

This is exactly why they keep their powder dry, because they don't have the power you're pointing to.

@Nonilex

@volkris

I'm sorry, but that's not right.

https://legalknowledgebase.com/who-enforces-federal-court-orders

US Marshals enforce orders of the court.

While the Marshals Service is part of DOJ, should the AG order Marshals to disobey the direction of a judge to enforce his order, I'll happily bet individual Marshals will obey the judge.

Beyond that, a judge can appoint another law enforcement agent to enforce an order. It'd be crazily bad for this to happen, but if the regime wants to drive itself off the cliff...

@Nonilex

@joeinwynnewood

You're confirming what I said, as does your link: the Marshals Service is part of the DOJ. Executive branch, not judicial, showing that the judicial branch doesn't have the power.

Even if we can rely on these executive branch agents to work with the courts, they are nonetheless exercising power from the executive branch.

And yes, this regime does want to drive itself of the cliff because it doesn't know how any of this works, same as when Trump drove himself right into a felony because he didn't know.

@Nonilex