Radley Balko responds to Substack's argument that it cannot exclude Nazis from its platform:
"The problem is that Substack hasn’t been letting everyone in. They’ve been drawing lines all along. They do moderate some content — sex worker newsletters, for example — which makes it harder to swallow the argument that the decision to keep hosting newsletters by Nazis (yes — actual Nazis) is grounded in some purist devotion to free speech."
https://radleybalko.substack.com/p/some-thoughts-on-the-substack-controversy
@wdlindsy
Nazis drink water and breathe air.
So, to prove that I have nothing in common with Nazis I will stop drinking water and breathing . . .
.
.
. . . perhaps I didn't quite think this through . . .
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy Drinking water and breathing air are not choices; they are necessities.
Associating with Nazis is a choice.
@LouisIngenthron @wdlindsy
Thank you for helping me think this through.
So - if I understand you correctly - continuing to use Substack because Nazis have started using it, means that I would be 'associating' with Nazis?
Like, if some Nazis moved into a house on the road where I live, then I should up and move? So I don't have to come across them at the local grocery store?
Or would I be better staying and telling everyone why they are a bunch of shits?
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy No, the owners of Substack have chosen to associate with Nazis, by choosing to continue to do business with them.
So, that leaves you with a value judgement to make. Do you want to continue participating in and supporting a platform that supports Nazis?
If a Nazi moves into a house in your neighborhood, there is no implicit support involved by coexisting with them.
But when you choose to go to a business that profits from them spreading their hate, now you're an active participant in a system that legitimizes them.
@LouisIngenthron @wdlindsy
So, if you're renting a house and you discover that your landlord is a Nazi, should you move out?
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy I mean, I probably wouldn't break my lease and pay penalties, but I also wouldn't renew it either. Ultimately, yes, I'd have a problem with a Nazi profiting from me in that manner.
@LouisIngenthron @wdlindsy
Would you tell your landlord why you won't renew the lease?
At what point would you tell him? When you found out that he's a Nazi, or when the lease comes up for renewal?
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy Probably not, unless asked. But after moving out, I would post it on Yelp and such so others can make an informed decision.
@LouisIngenthron @wdlindsy
Would you not consider engaging with your landlord and explaining why you think he is wrong? Explaining which of his beliefs are based on lies?
If I saw your review on Yelp I might think that this is like hanging a sign on the property saying, 'Nazis Welcomed'.
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy In my experience, there's not much point reasoning with people who are pro-genocide, and in some cases, attempting to do so can be actively dangerous.
Shunning and deplatforming tend to have a much better risk:reward ratio.
Also, if the owner is a Nazi, then the property might as well have that "Nazis welcome" sign. If Nazis want to associate with other Nazis, that's their right.
@LouisIngenthron @wdlindsy
You probably won't change the mind of a Nazi that you're debating.
But you probably will change the minds of those listening to you exposing the Nazi lies.
And that is how we defeat evil.
And, as far as it being dangerous - thank God we still have people like Alexei Navalny, with the courage to stand up to evil. They give hope to those that don't have the same measure of courage.
@AndyKotlarz @wdlindsy Do you typically have an audience when conversing with your landlord? More importantly, you only convince an audience if you win the debate; the potential for backfire can't be discounted.
However, in this example, the audience are the people on Yelp. Hence why I can be much more effective by writing reviews than by confronting the nazi landlord directly.
Navalny is fighting violent fascists with the power of the state at their disposal. That's a very different situation to opposing peaceful citizens who happen to be hatemongers. In the latter case, disassociation, shame, and shunning are proportionate responses.
