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Thankfully this happened in texas where right to carry laws means any shooter in a public space isnt likely to get very far.
@freemo You are baiting me and others, but arming the population is not working so well in US of A, is it?
Second Amendment was made at the time of Revolutionary War.
An armed populace, specially with full access to mil spec, assault weaponry?
I would prefer to live in a place without such. The fact people stopped this criminal is good, but tp think that so many are armed inside a church. Unholy.
all my opinions, of course, everyone has them, and we differ on this. Most countries do not allow an armed citizenry, and that hasn't deterred protest and political change when things are not agreeable to the people.
@design_RG Actually seems to be working really well in the USA, provided you arent hearing a propaganda spin on the numbers. In fact often times int he USA we see when we try to ban or restrict guns the death toll gets so out of control we wind up needing to reverse the ban and then numbers go back down. So from my perspective as a Data Scientist the numbers appear to be in favor of guns, though I do recognize there is a lot of corrupt "spin" on the numbers people hear sadly.
Mil spec is a bit of a misunderstood term. All mil spec means is that it is a reliable gun made out of high quality metals. It means nothing with regard to stopping power or rate of fire. Its a term I find is used with almost complete ignorance as to what it means in context.
Why would being armed be unholy, that sounds silly to me. There is nothing remotely morally wrong about a gun. Thats just hyperbole. In fact your whole response strikes me more as conditioning than anything else.
@freemo I did not want to start a long thread, arguing points we both believe in, have other tasks on hand that are more important and productive.
But, registering an opinion and voicing it, for the record.
The situation in America which everyone in the world sees quite well is how often gruesome shooting happens. The argument for granting people the right to bear arms is based on interpretation of a very short and terse, arguable, Colonial era piece of legislation. Enacted in a time when the future of the incipient republic was nowhere but granted.
I do find it appalling, what goes in there. I do have training and not afraid of using arms; had to get it when living in a location where public safety was ineffectual. In my opinion, best to live in a place where this is not required.
Coming armed to a place of worship strikes me as wrong, disturbing, without rationalizing it. It feels wrong, imo.
We come from totally different sides on this, but I wanted to register a different view. Otherwise people might use some fragments of posts in justifying censure to our instance, I am afraid.
Out for editing my day's blog... :smile:
@design_RG Yes it is quite sad people kill themselves.
Though the fallacy in that line of thinking is quite plan when you apply it to almost anything other than guns.
"In europe we banned guns, now gun based death has went down"...
"In crazytown we banned vaccines, now vaccine related death has went down"...
Yes banning a thing reduces death by that thing, on the surface to those who are acting on emotion, not data, that seems like a win, but as we see when you view the bigger picture it isnt.
Yes we can see that if you ban guns gun related deaths go down, but that completely ignores the fact that all other forms of homicide go up, and by a huge margin more often than not.
So yea sadly the situation everyone thinks they see in america is sadly a pretty strong indication that the people who "see" it are also the people not informed enough or objective enough to understand what they are seeing. Since any objective look at the data paints a very different picture.
The idea that being armed is inherently wrong or disturbing is the bias. Being capable of self defense and being able to save others should they be attacked is hardly unholy.
Your opinions are always welcome and you are welcome to discuss to as much or as little detail as you wish. But I wouldnt worry too much about people who might want to censor us for my or your opinions. We **want** those people to block us, thats in our best interest, so best not to try to stop it. We obviously dont want people intolerant of different opinions to be filling up our feeds.
@design_RG And yes I am bias, I am the proud owner of an AR-15.
@freemo Not in Netherlands, I imagine?
I confess to having found a beautiful swiss 9 mm pistol, used and for sale at the side of the road in Pennsylvania, and would love to have bought it. Fit my hands perfectly, better than the full size Beretta clone I had previously, in other lands.
They had rifles like yours, very useful if there's a war nearby. Technologically interesting to me, design and materials, all top notch.
But I am glad to live in a jurisdiction were this is not so easily obtainable and definitively never carry-able openly.
@design_RG The AR-15 is a small games rifle. Its intended purpose isnt War it is for shooting racoons and small animals. It isnt even powerful enough for Deer, for that you need a more powerful hunting rifle.
It isnt bad for self-defense though.
Dont take this as an attack, but you are clearly uneducated on this.. yes the AR-15 **is** a small game rifle.. for starts it is overwhelmingly used by farmers for that purpose as any farmer can tell you... 2, has one of the slowest muzzle velocities of any rifle out there.. If you tried to kill a deer at normal range with it the deer would just run away laughing at you.
The recommendation for dealing with raccoons in your trash is a Varmint Rifle.
That is to say, a pellet gun. Sportsmans.com suggests various small caliber guns, like the Rock Island M1911 pistol or the CZ457 Varmint .17 Cal
The largest gun they suggest is the Mossberg 505 pump action shotgun for versatility, and an air rifle for suburbs.
They never suggested an AR-15.
https://www.sportsmans.com/learn/hunting/choosing-the-perfect-gun-for-small-game-hunting
Also, the AR-15 can be outfitted to use .308 rounds for hunting bear.
Anyone using an AR-15 to hunt varmints in a psycho.
No an AR-15 TSKES 0.226 O
or if its mispec a nato 5.56. These are very much only capable on small game.
To use a .308 round on a ar-15 youd need a modified version of thr gun and therefore no longer coubts as an AR-15 as youve modified it into somethibg else.
Here is a little chart for you showing the bullets and the gsme they shoot. The 223 is the one an AR-15 shoots and as you can see it is one of the least powerful and limkted to small game.
@kinyutaka Attached is an image showing the appropriate bulled for various game. It clearly shiws that the 0.223, the bullet used in an ar15 is only useful for small game hunting.
Nonhubter woukd challenge this.
@freemo @design_RG
Bull. Shit.
The AR-15 is not a small game rifle for shooting raccoons. Using a semi-automatic rifle for shooting raccoons is straight up overkill.
I could understand "wild boar" or other vicious things that might attack and frenzy through a pistol, but they never intended the AR-15 to kill trash pandas.