🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@Gina So what im hearing is anyone who has ever rolled dice is insane :)

@thor Ahh I see.

It has been a very very long time since i used any of those sites (not cause of my GF thats only the last year, i just got sick of the low quality results)...

That said I remember on OKC that live chats were very ineffectual. Id have to send off a **lot** of messages to get responses.. maybe like one out of 30, and most of those didnt last more than one or twho exchanges... one in 50 might be a long term exchange

But the slower messages I seem to recall having more responses. I think this is more true for men cause the slower longer messages show more effort and the chats feel "lazy" as if a guy is just casting a wide net.

I can also say no matter what the medium if allyou do in response to a life is say "hi" or "hi, how are you" you will not get many responses at all.. If you lead with something interested you get way more. I have literally had women ont he service tell me multiple times they dont reply to just "hi" and only respond to people who make an effort in their first message.

@thor when you say they didnt reply to chat... do you mean like regular messages.. or like live chat (I know OKC and stuff like that have two ways to message, live and slow like email but on their site)?

@strawd I think we would agree exploitation in porn is morally wrong, porn itself is not.

As a general rule only time I'd say its morally questionable is if 1) you spend money on it and 2) you know the porn you bought involved exploitation when you bought it.

@TruthSandwich

Can you please tell me which bills Trump has proposed or supported that explicitly attempt to enact segregation? I cant think of one... In fact I cant think of any segregation or racist thing that even approaches Biden in that regard.

That said What Trump has or hasnt done in terms of racist has absolutely nothing to do with if Biden is or isnt racist.

@unabomber

@TruthSandwich QED

@TruthSandwich

> He is a Republican candidate, but he's running as a Democrat with the goal of hurting Biden.

I think everyone is aware of that except RFK himself... pretty sure he thinks his big is legit.. but yea we all know its notand he is a joke.

> At this time, we don't know whether he'll be running in the general after he loses the primaries.

I suspect he would...

Odd thing is, he has polled better in some polls than biden by a large margin (in other polls he has done worse). I highly doubt he will win, but just his name alone is enough for most democrats in polls to say they support him. I suspect that will only last until he becomes popular enough to actual get news time, at which point his support will drop to near 0.

> But we can be sure he'll be claiming that his loss was "rigged" because he's trying to crush our confidence in democracy and suppress votes on the left.

Maybe, I doubt he is intentionally trying to support the republicans. So i have my doubts that is his play... that said he is such a pro-conspiracy theory guy he might play exactly that card even thought he didnt intend to support the republicans.

> Wait for the toots that say, "I would have voted for Biden, even though I hate him for being a liberal, but the evil DNC rigged the primaries against true-progressive RFK Jr., and now I'm going to vote for Trump to punish Biden."

If they were going to pull that card they could have picked a much better pawn.

@TruthSandwich Oh he doesnt stand a chance in hell of winning, he is a complete lunatic. As for him helping Trump... quite the opposite. He has far more support fromt he right, if anything he will take away swing votes that might have voted for trump. In fact, he feels like he should be a republican ticket, his stance reads very republican.

@voidabyss

> The is a category of self-harm that might not be due to underlying suffering or mental illness, which is Self-sacrifice, it involves enduring hardship and putting the needs and welfare of others before one’s own, like voluntary soldiers, doctors, ems, nurses, etc. Self-sacrifice is often motivated by compassion, love, and a sense of duty towards others.

Sure that exists too... but are you saying those are the only two?

What about things that harm ones self, but is not due to any underlying unhealthy mental state, and also doesnt benefit anyone else.

A tattoo or scarification is an example I would think you would agree with. I would hope you agree that these are not (usually) due to mental illness, they also dont benefit others, and do in fact cause harm to ones self. So how do we handle that in your model? Its clearly self-harm, but in your model its an exception somehow? why?

@Foxmonsieur

You too, i enjoyed it and appreciate the mutual respect.

@Bradcopter @georgetakei

@Foxmonsieur

> You're right we're splitting hair there (but it's very interesting).

Yea might not have been the most relevant, but it was an interesting tangent.

> People can form an opinion and they can see this situation from one side or another and debate about it, it's their right. But when it comes to the case, what she's done should be considered in context and on a human scale too.

Sure Id agree with that.

> I may be partial as a (foreign) writer, but on the human side I think she should be at least held in contempt of unions for her disrespect for her peers.

I think it is fair to say that her actions showed that supporting the strike was not something she felt particularly compelled to do. But as you say the human side should be considered here, and I think people not only need to be cut some slack for bad choices they correct away from, but its also REALLY hard for most humans to admit they were wrong and change their mind as a response to public opinion too.. Personally I applaud her for being able to say she was wrong at all (even though i may not think she was all that wrong)

@Bradcopter @georgetakei

@johnabs

So the main purpose of morality is to encourage behaviors that make society the most fit society possible? (fit as in having the ability to thrive)

@bii

@Foxmonsieur

Legal judgements asidem, as its only an analogy and not the useful... the way i see it she basically said "I intend to cross this picket line in about a month".. then a week later said "I will not"

In the end all i care about is that she didnt cross it. It seems silly to me to hold her to something she never did... but you are welcome to your opinion of course. Like i said, I dont really think the strike is justified at all, so we are both biased fromt he get go anyway.

@Bradcopter @georgetakei

@Foxmonsieur

Criminal intent is an element of law, but not itself a charge.

Attempt Charge is the charge (or one example of a charge) and one of the requirements to be guilty of an Attempt Charge is that criminal intent must be shown. We are splitting hairs here now, point is we were both right but talking about different things and the important part is I now know what you meant when you said "thats why they call it intent", I thought you meant that intent is a criminal charge, which its not, you just meant intent is an aspect of the law, and yea.

> Now, it's not up to the public to decide anything about this matter. It's a negociation and a battle between unions, their members and the companies. She's in an actors guild acting openly in solidarity with the writers guild, it's up to them.

Yea I agree with this, its between them to negotiate so its between them to decide how or if it effects that. sure. So if you are saying we shouldnt form opinions about her in regard to this and neither attack nor absolve her.. thens ure, ill go with that.

@Bradcopter @georgetakei

@voidabyss

> I don’t agree with that assessment, nor the examples your mentioned as “self-harm”.

Ok sure lets go through it then.

> Here are some examples of self-harm and people engaging in those should seek help.

We are trying to figure out the rules, so jumping to examples is great, but that doesnt help unless you can tell me the rules that determine if an example qualifies. In this case you are trying to define what self-harm is, but the examples dont get us there... even if i use them they contradict. for example....

> Self-harm: This refers to intentionally causing harm to oneself, such as cutting, burning, or hitting oneself.

Ok so just this example alone agrees with most of my examples.

Eating extremely unhealthy food causes harm, I think thats pretty undeniable. Also when we eat extremely unhealthy food it is intentional. So it meets your two criteria for what is self harm in this example, being that it is harmful and intention to one's self.

Same thing for my other examples, tattoos, scarification, literally everything i listed qualifies under your statement of what self harm is above.. yet you claim it isnt... why?

For me the examples you are giving feel alot more like "things that are not good to do" and a lot less like "things that are immoral to do". Making bad decisions isnt the same as making immoral decisions.

@AGTMADCAT

> Do you have any concrete examples of strikes being used for bad causes and having any success?

None that were large enough to make the news or have citeable sources, and that i can actually remember the name of, just the ones ive seen personally, and certainly not all of them. That said i dont exactly stay up to date on all the strikes around the world either.

That said I am sure there are plenty examples of strikers asking for unreasonable demands.

> I'm not aware of any significant or successful labor actions which have been used to increase oppression.

While I cant tell you any specific strikes, I certainly know of the general case where this happens all the time. It is a very common practice among unions, particularly labour unions, to force negotiatiosn in their favor that oppresses the non-union workers in the work place. For example when unions strike it is not uncommon to use as their demand a contractual requirement that they are only allowed to hire union members. This oppresses the right for employees to choose for themselves which union they wish to support, or form opposing unions that might fix issues the employee has with current unions. Taking away all current and future employees rights to choosing a union (or to choose not to be in one) is absolutely a very common example of strikes resulting in oppression.

> I would argue, though, that in the current world people are generally feeling disenfranchised and powerless, and that any kind of successful organized action shows people that they can stand up for themselves against the rich and powerful.

I'd say quite the opposite. People are feeling arogant and self-entitled. Anything right now that adds fuel to the fire and reinforces the bad behavior (like rioting, violence, etc) is the last thing we need. But I also think this is a really bad reason to support a strike, any strike.

@georgetakei

@Foxmonsieur

I think we agree that the writers, her staff, and anyone involved with her have the right to have any opinion they want of her actions, and act on it.

But your statement doesnt seem to account for how the public can determine if the writers are the ones int he wrong (not saying they are)... but seems your suggesting the public should defer to the writers to decide how to respond to her actions... But if the general public always followed that game plan it seems like there would be no protection against protecting against strikes where the strikers demands are unreasonable.

@Bradcopter @georgetakei

@bii I mean i agree with your definition. erotica is "lighter" than porn sure.

@Foxmonsieur

> Nothing there happened by accident, she didn't do it unknowingly.

In my analogy I am not claiming she did it by accident or unknowingly.. Even if intentional, someone puts something in their pocket with every intention of stealing it. As long as if in the end they dont actually steal it. That they realize on their way to walk out that the consequences are too high and the last minute changes their mind and pays for it... guess what, they wont be arrested. Even though it wasnt by accident, it was intentional and theft was the intention, it still wouldnt get them in jail if in the end they didnt follow through and paid.

> Reasonable doubt is also not applicable here, wanting and planning to do wrong/illegal things is legally called an intent for this very reason.

Well its a bit more complicated than all that. First off "intent" is not the legal term. I think you re confusing it with "attempt". There are two criminal terms relevant to what we are discutting "Attempt Charges" and "Conspiracy Charges". Attempt charges is what we are talking about not "intent", easy mistake to make.

Anyway the thing about Attempt Charges is simply planning the crime in and of itself is not, usually, considered enough to get Attempt Charges. As a general rule you have to do more than just make plans, usually you have to at least show you made some attempt to carry out those plans. Like if you planned a robbery on paper, that isnt enough, but if you actually went out and got the floor plans and bought a crow bar AND had the plans, then you would probably get stuck with Attempt Charges.

All thats a bit moot, but worth touching on. With that said im not really sure if she would get Attempt charges or not in this analogy. But it plays to my point, if she had actually started paying for and preparing the neccesary elements to start the show, then yes, that would be enough. But if all she did was talk about her intent to start the show and then literally 2 days later changes her mind, no I doubt that would work.

> She didn't forget some chewing gums in her pockets, she took action to come back with her show. She openly spoke about coming back and announced it, knowing she'd break the pickets lines.

I mean i never claimed she forgot something or made a mistake. She intended to reopen the show, 2 days later she decided not to. It was literally a decision she made, did nothing to carry it out, and decided it was a bad idea 2 days later.

Honestly nothing against you, but this is the very reason the left has been struggling lately. Because even when people ultimately do whats right (even if they had a momentary lapse of judgement) that is never enough. We attack even the people who ultimately choose to be our allys till there are no allys left. This has to stop.
@Bradcopter @georgetakei