🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@TruthSandwich

Yea that play could work, despite being a little risky per my last comment, I think this could be the worst case (and perhaps what the republicans and maybe RFK are planning)

@ech

@stux ::eyes you suspiciously::

@mnutty

> I’ll continue to push back here.

You feel free to push back as much as you want. As long as its respectful discourse it is welcome.

> Was he pandering to racist opposition to integration 50 years ago?

I mean he was the figure head, spearheading the movement. It literally motivated him to get into politics and was his main focus for over a decade. This is evidence from congressional transcripts where he has actively spearheaded and pushed the fight against desegregation.

To take that, and rewrite it as "he was just pandering to some racists".. well for 1 it isnt accurate and for 2 since when was it ok to be a racist to make other racists happy so you can gain power? Hard for me to fathom.

Plus, i mean its not like it was left 50 years ago...we have the same veiled but very evident racism even now with examples I pointed out.

> If I’m reading your commentary correctly, you suggest Biden is now a practioner of veiled racism.

Poorly veiled as some of the examples shows, but yes. I mean if he truly changed his ways he would have at a minimum apologized for spending a decade trying to keep segregation alive.

> I think that doesn’t square with his selection of VP Harris as his number 2 and accepting the VP position under President Obama.

Why not? It lines up exactly with what we would expect of someone exploiting minorities to get in power. He was VP under Obama knowing he could do that to become president (and it worked) and he elected Harris knowing doing so would cause people to say things like " I think that doesn’t square with his selection of VP Harris as his number 2 and accepting the VP position under President Obama.". He knew exploiting them and other minorities would whitewash his past history with racism and groping women. So he did, and it worked, and you are now responding how you are because it worked... meanwhile his language and actions show quite clearly the racism man behind the mask.

@stux Probably just some government propaganda trying to convince me birds are real or something.

"Shame about the meek, they dont inherit shit" -- 12 monkies

@samir Congrats. WI2ARD here,

@TruthSandwich

Wait, republicans can vote in a DNC primary. And if we are talking the general it is Biden or RFK not both.

Only way that might work is if when he looses the primary he goes independent. In that case yea. But its risky cause it may backfire and take away Trumps swing vote since there is another republican like candidate ont he ballot.

@ech

@TruthSandwich

I will make sure of it, just for you.

@ech

@tess Who would have ever thought we would find a way to convert lead to gold and it would be more expensive than the gold itself :)

@stux Im confused. What does the fact that birds arent real have to do with conspiracies?

@TruthSandwich

I mean, I have before overestimated humans.. Things i often think are so obvious couldnt possible work and the next day its everyones daily mantra.

I mean its hard to think someone like RFK could even come close to fooling anyone, even his own family has called him out for running... but i dunno never underestimate the stupidity of voters either.

Honestly I think im betting more on their short memory than their intelligence though. I do often notice that things said in primary debates almost never carry over to the general election. And this case being a bit more obviously fake I would hope that will be the case here as well.

@ech

@TruthSandwich

I was afraid this might happen one day... I'll let it slide, but i expect you to start calling me names again the moment I have my next opinion!

@ech

@TruthSandwich

Yea, they are.

If he wasnt so obviously aligned on issues with the republicans it might have even worked a little bit... but he is just a little too obvious.

@ech

@TruthSandwich

Right, that was my point... we were in agreement on west.

@ech

@TruthSandwich

> There are lots of ways to spoil besides running directly against someone.

Yes, there are

> I mentioned two of them: repeating right-wing attacks from the ostensible left and denying that you legitimately lost the primaries.

You did.

> Both of these can be expected to suppress turnout for Biden.

They wont.. by the time the election rolls around no one will even remember who RFK is.. hell he is still int he running and the son/nephew of 2 assassinated presidential candidates, and yet 2/3 of people dont even know he is running. And this is before he has even lost the primary, he will be a distant memory after the fact.

@ech

@TruthSandwich

As I pointed out... west looks like a horrible choice. He looks like a bernie. Id even vote for someone as horrible and racist as Biden over that.

That said I agree, west is far more likely to steal Biden votes than anyone else.

@ech

@mnutty

> I may choose to disagree with you but I like to think I can do so civilly
>
> I’d push back against the notion that #Biden has an “extremely racist history”.

Thank you that is great to hear, and I respect that.. the discussion is one I welcome when done in a civil way. I just have had so many bad run ins fromt he left and the right im a bit wary.

One little disclaimer going in, My parents are friends with Biden, have been for decades. He has more than once been over our home, eaten dinner at our table, and slept in our guest room.

> I’d push back against the notion that #Biden has an “extremely racist history”.

I think a lot of people would, there are two types of racists int he world.

1) The kind who feels thinks and acts in racist ways in their own head, but actually still cares about being popular so will go out of their way to hide it or try to explain away their racist actions with non-racist explanation and excuses

2) the kind who has no filter or no shame, doesnt really care if everyone lives them or not... They will spew whatever racist shit they think or feel and wont do a damn thing to hide it, if anything they might even exagerate their racism when they speak.

Trump is #2 and Biden is #1, and while biden will seem or feel far less racist to most anyone who gives it some serious thought I feel needs to admit that in terms of policy and actions, Biden has a history of more racism than trump.

Lets start i at the begning of his career, int he 70s and into the 80s for the better part of a decade he actively opposed desegregation efforts, he was not just vocal against it but a main figure head in keeping segregation alive. Bussing, the act of allowing blacks to ride the bus to nearby all-white schools to break segregation is something he aggressively opposed. For some context in the 1977 congressional hearing on the matter when he was talking about his opposition to desegregation proposals here is a quote he said from that hearing:

"Unless we do something about this, my children are going to grow up in a jungle, the jungle being a racial jungle"

This went on for the better part of a decade until he started to realize it was hurting his chances for reelection. Once he realized that he kept doing what he was doing and changed his tune and instead of disenfranchizing blacks to stay in office he started to exploit them instead (something he has doubled down on since he got elected to presidency).

Now his approach is different... On the one hand he constantly talks down to them and tells them he knows better than other black people what is best for the black community. He even goes so far as to hire almost exclusively minorities to every position without any concern for their capabilities or if they are best... all he cares about is showing people how not racist he is by exploiting minorities he surroungs himself with so people will say things like "Yea he was prosegregation and all, but he has changed, look he has black friends!". Like lets be fair, if he just cared about minorities and not doing it for personal gain we might see a higher than usual number of minorities... but he went so over the top I dont think anyone in their right mind will buy it as sincere, especially when it so clearly works to get reelected.

To quote biden on this second poiunt I just made... a good example is "If you dont vote for me, you aint black". That sends two messages 1) White man joe knows better than black people who disagree with him what is best for black people... and that he is more black than some black people. This is amazingly racist because it also suggests black people act a certain way .. which leads us to 2) he used the word "aint" a word that was intentionally and he almost never uses. He used improper broken english as one would expect an uneducated person to use, because in his mind this is how you talk to black people, you need to act uneducated to relate to them.

And do we even need to get into all the women he has touched inappropriately, grabbing arms, sniffing hair, in a few cases even when these ladies were physically pulling away or recoiling in disgust.... it shows a very very troubled mentality.

If you are interested here is an article going into more depth regarding his history of racist remarks, I havent checked it but it may be useful for you:

https://www.heritage.org/progressivism/commentary/bidens-history-getting-away-racist-remarks

@TruthSandwich this post now has me wondering if I would prefer hillary or biden... hmm

@TruthSandwich

Comparing Stein, someone who largely spews left sentiment, to RFK, someone who despite claiming to be on the DNC team clearly has republican aligned views... they arent remotely the same or comparable.

@ech