@thor

This is generally my impression. A lot of addiction, too, which is why I favor making addiction as inexpensive and easy as possible.

At least localizes the problem.

I don't know how to save everyone. It's not in nature's plan at least.

I hope things work out for your sister.

@amerika @thor

It has been said many times we are losing the war on drugs.

If you legalise supply you control not only the supply but the purity and strength, that way you know what you are getting.

10mg of paracetamol from a pharmacy should be just that for example but in this case applied to I guess Heroin and cocaine among others.

Then you work on reducing the dependency, a t the same time as that try and deal with the mental health or other issues that have caused the addiction

Of course this also means that these substances can be tax, so lets tax them and put 100 percent of that in to providing free detox, mental health and other support.

As with other problems, it is fixable if we are prepared to be tough enough to have these hard discussions and make hard decisions as to how to solve the issues involved.

@zleap @thor

I oppose legalization and favor decriminalization.

Our goal is not to make drug use safe, only to make it less destructive.

In my view, the markets do a good job of regulating quality.

I also have very little faith in detox programs.

It's all up to the user, and most who quit do it on their own.

@amerika @zleap @thor I think opening up legal markets for what are currently considered illicit drugs would be beneficial for a number of reasons. A non violent drug user who isn't stealing to feed their habit literally harms no one except potentially themselves first and foremost. Keeping things in gray or black markets leads to impurities and dangerous additives, but more than that it creates a scenario where violence becomes perceived as necessary for businesses to secure their profits. The legal markets are protected by the government who claims monopoly on use of force. Illegal markets have to do this for themselves.

This isn't to say other black markets should be given legal status, but in the case of individuals partaking in activities that only put themselves at risk I see no reason for disallowing it.

Alcohol is one of the hardest drugs on the body, and we have nearly 100k deaths a year from excessive use. Drunk driving adds to that number victims of bad decisions while intoxicated.

@thatguyoverthere @zleap @thor

I tend to agree with legal but unregulated/untaxed markets.

Localize the damage.

@amerika @zleap @thor One regulation I do think is important is that ingredients should be accurately listed. One big problem with a dark drug market is that there is no way to ensure potency or even content is what's expected which can lead to unnecessary premature death. I don't think it's the government's place to decide what you put in your body, but if you think you are buying substance "a" at potency "x" that's all it should be. no extra additives unless they are listed.
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@thatguyoverthere @thor @amerika

This is surely where legalisation / regulation comes in, you know what your getting / paying for.

However with the dark drug market surely people should also be taking some degree of self responsibility too. You know the risks, you chose to take them. Government as you say can / should only go so far.

@zleap @thatguyoverthere @thor

No, I think the message needs to be clear: we don't endorse this; you're taking your chances.

I want government out of as much as possible, and localized personal responsibility in as much as possible.

@amerika @thatguyoverthere @thor

I think this is what I was getting at,

Open science about the risks, backed with the science / data and you give people informed choices.

Laws cannot keep up with science.

@amerika @thatguyoverthere @thor

Well yes, we have laws on libel, slander and deframation (as does the US) but if the new online safety bill also includes this, then it makes it harder to bring charges if someone is charged under the wrong law, in the case of the abvoe it would possibly be better to amend the existing laws to explicitly include online. .

We also have the telecommunications act to stop malicious use of the phone lines (which includes internet)

Online harms bill is going to make social media platforms more liable, (in theory but as another thread highlighted facebook are already trying to circumvent data protection laws (GDPR) by claiming gathering of certain info is needed.

@thatguyoverthere @thor @amerika

It is not just illegal drugs, people buy viagra online not knowing what they are actually getting, consumer program have given these fake products to labs to test and the have all sorts of stuff in , paint, sawdust etc oh and rat droppings etc due to being made in unhygienic conditions.

I suppose it Viagra is meant to make you stiff, then it does what it says on the tin, only in this case stiff = dead.

@zleap @thatguyoverthere @thor

Permanent priapism via rigor mortis? I love it. That's very morbid of you, and I commend that.

The question of business accountability is a huge one. Do we have a better business bureau, regulate, or let lawsuits do it?

I like lawsuits since they tend to end bad companies.

@amerika @thatguyoverthere @thor

We need to make it easier / cheaper to sue people BUT have safe guards in place to deal with malicious suits (look at patent trolls)

It confuses me how people who commit murder can't be sued under the EU/ UK human rights act for denial of life or family life by their victims family. BUT if that person stubs their toe in the shower in prison they can claim damages.

@zleap @thatguyoverthere @thor

The main way to make it easier/cheaper is to make it faster.

I agree.

I think countersuits should be more common.

I think but do not know that in the UK, in many suits, the losing party pays costs.

There are advantages to that if the suit is spurious, for example.

@amerika @thatguyoverthere @thor

I think they do yes, it has happened in insurance fraud cases where a fairly small claim say 40k ended up with a huge legal bill forcing fraudster to sell their home.

@zleap @thatguyoverthere @thor

I think it's good to have some legal decisions that destroy bad businesses.

Like all these phone spammers... I'm getting spam calls in Spanish only now.

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