🎓 Dr. Freemo 🇳🇱 @freemo@social.cleverlibre.org

@ciarin7@toot.community

I dont know how many times your going to agree with me and start it with "incorrect"... but here we go again...

> Her show was already on the list of WGA shows, before she decided to bring the show back.

And at what point did I say that wasnt the case?

> Her show is struck based on the rules of the guild, she had WGA writers.

Yup. When the people who compiled the list had to form an opinion on which qualified and which didnt they used the rules of the guild to do so. Since she had WGA writers in the past they decided to add it to the striked list.

> It's not based on opinion, as you erroneously claimed.

My best guess is that your misunderstanding what the word opinion means.

You do realize you can hold an opinion that happens to be fact right? An opinion may or may not be fact or based on fact. While opinions that arent facts will always just be opinions, opinions which are facts, are still opinions, they are fact-based opinions.

Here is the definition fromt he dictionary"

"a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge."

Pay close attention to the word "necessarily", clearly showing opinions are still opinions even when they happen to be rooted in facts.

@georgetakei

@wendinoakland

Yes I am the one who mentioned Cancel Culture. My point is what you are describing, namely "bad behavior erases you from the story", is NOT what Cancel Culture is. We would just call that boycotting. Its responsible and when justified what society SHOULD do.

My point is responsible boycotting, as you describe, is distinctly different from Cancel Culture which is where boycotting is using frivilously, irresponsibly, against actors who are not clearly bad actors but nebulous at best, and where such canceling is central to the culture.

Im all for good responsible boycotts, but Cancel Culture, the irresponsible use, is a valid concern and good to call out as well.

Now as i said if this counts as a legit boycott or Cancel Culture is a a matter of opinion.

@georgetakei

@wendinoakland

Bad behavior has consequences, nothing wrong with that. Thats not what the phrase "Cancel Culture" has issue with, boycotting bad actors responsibly is a good thing and should be encouraged, obviously thats not what the term "Cancel Culture" is refering to. The term "Cancel Culture" is when Canceling (boycotts) are both frivilous and have become central to our culture.

Whether this is Cancel Culture vs responsible boycotting is obviously a matter of opinion. But those two concepts are also very different things.

@georgetakei

@ciarin7@toot.community

Holy hell, you are still arguing against fictional things I didnt say....

> Nope, still a fact her show was already on the list of WGA shows and therefore struck.

At no point did I say her show was or was not on the list of WGA shows.

You are literally arguing with a fantasy of something being said that wasnt said, its really annoying.

> What's silly is that several people have attempted to explain to you what cancel culture is but you refuse to accept the correction.

How many wrong people need to say something before I am obligated to accept it as true? The number of people who may disagree with me doesnt really matter when they are all wrong... just like if I got a bunch of Trumpers in here all saying the same nonsense it doesnt make them right either.

> irony

Finally something we agree on.

@georgetakei

@ciarin7@toot.community

> Incorrect, it's a fact. Her show is listed as a struck show, and they will be picketing it.

Yup, they were of the **opinion** that she was in violation, and decided to list the show as a striked show...

The fact that they listed it as striked is fact. It is the strikers **opinion**, and the decision that fueled, that caused them to make that decision.

> ...Not what the unions use to determine which shows are struck shows.

Of course not, they use their opinions to determine what to strike, not mine, duh.

When did I say my opinion is what unions base their decisions on? Its like your arguing against some imagined argument not even being discussed... your arguing against things i didn't disagree with.

> Incorrect. Consequences may include boycotts, but boycotts are not the only consequences when there's a backlash.

This is really getting silly now.. you keep saying you disagree with me, then state a bunch of stuff that in no way disagrees with me.

At no point did I say or even hint, that somehow boycotts are the only consequence when there is backlash... literally this whole comment was just you disagreeing with stuff I never asserted because you didnt bother to read what you disagreed with carefully first.

> Irrelevant

Since you are arguing that a term i used means something other than what it meant, and that understanding terminology is key to accurate communitication, it is very much relevant at this point.

@georgetakei

@ciarin7@toot.community

> She's crossing a picket line, her show is a struck show. That's why she's being called a scab.

Yes that is the opinion of the strikers it seems. My opinion is that she is perfectly ok with what she did morally and the strikers are wrong to take issue with it. To each their own, we dont have to agree.

> Cancel culture is just a silly way of saying consequences. It's not a real thing, people just want to pretend there's a new wave of mob mentality punishing people, and it's just sometimes people get a backlash for their actions.

No you are thinking of the word Boycott. Cancel Culture is not simply any act of boycotting... It is when **frivilous** boycotts are central to the current culture. This is distinctly different from all acts of canceling someone (the word "Culture" in "Cancel Culture" isnt just there for show).

> It's not new, it's consequences.

Boycotting isnt new.. Cancel Culture is, re:above

@georgetakei

@olives was this meant as a reply to something maybe?

@collin If flights werent so uncomfortable for me id do this... I doubt id enjoy it with how miserable i am on a plane though.

@collin I really cant fly anything other than first class anymore... it really is worth it.

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

> Granted, but its not the only thing that's in overdrive and frivolous nowadays.

Agreed

> Which is why I said that it wasn't the problem, it was one symptom of the problem.

Also agree, it is more a symptom than the root problem.

> Hopefully if (normally I'd say when, but I'm not so sure that it'll happen) things calm down, we'll see a return to a "normal cancel culture" like it was in the days of yore. 😅

One can hope :)

@georgetakei

@MaryPot

You seem mistaken on what the term "Cancel Culture" means. A culture in which reasonable and occasional boycotts are employed is NOT cancel culture... thats just boycotting and its been around forever and its perfectly fine.

Cancel Culture is pointing out a culture where **frivolous** boycotting is central the the culture.

The distinction is important to having a productive conversation here.

@georgetakei

@MaryPot

> If you read the article, she employs (employed?) 3 writers who are on strike now.

I did read the article, and what part of my statement do you feel was in error given this fact? Nothing i said disagrees with what you just said.

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

> I think it was already here before, but it got a significant boom when smartphones became a thing & we got instant access to anything & everything.

I mean people canceled things before sure, and there were frivolous examples of it. But it was more of a rarity. It seems to be in overdrive the last few years (which is where the distinction comes in too)

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

> Conceptually I agree, but who's the "we" in this example?

The human race or any group thereof.

:)

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

> It was already here. I'm constantly reminded of that woman that made a stupid joke before boarding a 12 hour flight to find she'd been fired when she landed.

Cant say I agree... People have been boycotting since forever. But prior to the last few years it was far less frivolous than it has become in recent years.

> What probably changed is what I mentioned in the other reply.
> We are so divided nowadays that this has almost become a type of warfare.
> I cancel the actor you like, you cancel the actor I like. I cancel the beer you love, I cancel the beer you love, and so on and so forth.

Here we agree, the (IMO) recent development of Cancel Culture is closely linked to what you say here.

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

Sure but as per my last comment, Cancel Culture (that is, boycotting frivilously) seems to have happened quite a bit later after the instant gratification had already been a thing for decades.

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

Sure, but that immediate response thing has been around long before the dynamic arose of frivolous boycotts. If they were as closely linked as you suggest I would have expected them to both emerge at the same time, not with a 20 year lag.

@georgetakei

@Rui_ALF_Chaves

Nothing wrong with canceling that which we find deserving.

The issue is the frivolity in which we "cancel" these days has reached a point of absurdity.

@georgetakei

@sdgathman

> On the carbon in soil issue, read "Folks, this ain't normal" by Joel Salatin. His other book are great too.

I dont want to read some randos book only to find I have the same questions and it still sounds wrong and now i just dont have the ability to discuss.

If you understand it and wish to explain why the logic doesnt add up for me, go for it. It could be a valuable discussion. Otherwise based on what has been said, iwthout further evidence, im going to conclude that what you claimed is incorrect information.

> I belatedly realized I need to decentralize food production as well as computing, and am learning as fast as I can.

Eh, no ones perfect :)

@matthewjones @oedp_ruhrmitte @lonelyowl

@DryBird227@mastodon.social

I asked you to leave me alone. Since I asked you to do that you have now messaged me twice. Once as a direct response to me asking you not to message me.

Next step is I block and report you. Go away now, I stopped caring.

@georgetakei